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Getting a job in the industry for the first time
quote: Original post by ncsu121978
And I can tell you.....c++ and girls dont go together (from what I have seen).
"Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time"
- Monty Python and the Holy Grail
themGames Productions
Yeah, but beer & C++ sure does. There''s nothing more interesting than how code looks through the distorted view of drunkeness.
This is a very personal issue so I will only say what works for me. I started programming two years ago with QBasic, then Masm/assembly, then C, and now MFC and C++ and STL. Before getting into graphics I read intel os/cpu manuals and got a simple bootup code written up and some parser/scanner code done in assembly. I finally decided that I would like to rather work with graphics. So I started learning things on my own initiative. Now comes the juicy part: If you can learn from books, have determination and truly want to learn how things work and why then you don''t have to go to college.
I spent 2 1/2 years at University of Washington before I gave up (studied economics). I came home and been burried in programming ever since. So as you can see if you don''t mind reading a lot of material you''ll do ok. I love solving problems but math is not my strong point. I do however try to create a code based on KISS (keep it simple stupid
principle and it worked out great so far.
In university you barely have time to sit down with the professors and discuss your problems because there is always someone there already or people are waiting on you to hurry up and finish so they too can get their turn. In college you get a list of books to buy (are avail. through amazon.com) and have to read them. Then you go to lectures and it''s the same stuff that you read from the books. Waste of time. Don''t forget that you can''t go directly into programming but have to take the core requirenments for me it was: Pre-calculus, calculus 1,2,3; physics 1,2,3; history, couple of writing classes and discussions, chemistry and probably others I forgot.
You really start learning your specialized topics when you become a Junior. For me college was a frustration because simply there were not enough people to be found who could explain it to me in plain english (English is a second language for me, I''m from Slovakia). I find the art of explanation to be a rare skill and if you can find someone that will have the time and the skill never let him go. Some programmers think they''re hotshots but fail to realize that the person next to them who doesn''t know any programming has skills or know-how that the programmer doesn''t. I say keep you ego at home, preferably locked in a closet.
Basically it boils down to this: Go to the university website and find the class you''re interested in. I''m willing to bet that the book they want you to buy, you can get through Amazon.com. Lecture notes are ok but miss a lot of important detail, they''re notes after all. Buy the book and study it. If you can learn from the book and you feel that you can intelligently think about the unknowns and knowns in your problem set and can separate them and try to find a generic solution that can be applied to the problem that will solve problems that you don''t even know exist then you have it made and university would be a waste of your time.
I found the sheer size of the code I''m writing (CSG - union, intersection, difference) quite daunting but experience tells me to solve it piece by piece and it no longer seems to be a monster it once was Very soon I will upload a demo of this program and code (so far I have union and intersection working, now only A-B and B-A to be done)to my website. For those that are working with DirectX 2D games, see my website for a simple game I made utilizing almost all the features of this api including music.
Jerry
my homepage
E-Mail: BlueOrbSoftware@mailcity.com
I spent 2 1/2 years at University of Washington before I gave up (studied economics). I came home and been burried in programming ever since. So as you can see if you don''t mind reading a lot of material you''ll do ok. I love solving problems but math is not my strong point. I do however try to create a code based on KISS (keep it simple stupid
principle and it worked out great so far. In university you barely have time to sit down with the professors and discuss your problems because there is always someone there already or people are waiting on you to hurry up and finish so they too can get their turn. In college you get a list of books to buy (are avail. through amazon.com) and have to read them. Then you go to lectures and it''s the same stuff that you read from the books. Waste of time. Don''t forget that you can''t go directly into programming but have to take the core requirenments for me it was: Pre-calculus, calculus 1,2,3; physics 1,2,3; history, couple of writing classes and discussions, chemistry and probably others I forgot.
You really start learning your specialized topics when you become a Junior. For me college was a frustration because simply there were not enough people to be found who could explain it to me in plain english (English is a second language for me, I''m from Slovakia). I find the art of explanation to be a rare skill and if you can find someone that will have the time and the skill never let him go. Some programmers think they''re hotshots but fail to realize that the person next to them who doesn''t know any programming has skills or know-how that the programmer doesn''t. I say keep you ego at home, preferably locked in a closet.
Basically it boils down to this: Go to the university website and find the class you''re interested in. I''m willing to bet that the book they want you to buy, you can get through Amazon.com. Lecture notes are ok but miss a lot of important detail, they''re notes after all. Buy the book and study it. If you can learn from the book and you feel that you can intelligently think about the unknowns and knowns in your problem set and can separate them and try to find a generic solution that can be applied to the problem that will solve problems that you don''t even know exist then you have it made and university would be a waste of your time.
I found the sheer size of the code I''m writing (CSG - union, intersection, difference) quite daunting but experience tells me to solve it piece by piece and it no longer seems to be a monster it once was
Very soon I will upload a demo of this program and code (so far I have union and intersection working, now only A-B and B-A to be done)to my website. For those that are working with DirectX 2D games, see my website for a simple game I made utilizing almost all the features of this api including music.Jerry
my homepage
E-Mail: BlueOrbSoftware@mailcity.com
Just to expand on what some of the other guys said: if you go to a UK university, then you won''t have to waste time on history, writing classes, chemistry, or anything like that which doesn''t relate to computing. JD''s experience is obviously of a US university where they have a much wider range of classes, whereas a computing degree here would see you doing programming right from day 1.
However... unless you went to a really good university, the chances of them teaching you much that will exceed your current abilities (at least, I am guessing so, looking at the screenshot) is almost nil, unless you are programming totally in C. In which case, a good grounding in OOP, C++, design issues, algorithms, and data structures, are all likely to get taught to you on, for example, a BSc Computing/Computer Studies course.
Someone mentioned that you won''t have much creative input as a programmer in someone else''s company, and they''re probably right. One of the great things about university is that you get lots and lots of free time... that time can be translated into you getting -your- game made. You will also meet numerous like-minded individuals on your course who may be able to help with your game, if you asked them. They too, will have lots of free time. You don''t get many opportunities in life to do whatever you want, and also to make that many contacts.
Regarding the debt thing, if you took out govt. student loans here, the rates are very reasonable and you won''t have to start repaying until you earn a decent amount anyway. You will never get offered any loans at such good rates again!
Finally, as was already pointed out, jobs are not forever, especially in the technology industry, and a degree will help you find subsequent jobs, or find better paid jobs, or more fun jobs. For an investment of 3-4 years (during which you can also be making your own game!), you gain a substantial step up on the career ladder for the future.
However... unless you went to a really good university, the chances of them teaching you much that will exceed your current abilities (at least, I am guessing so, looking at the screenshot) is almost nil, unless you are programming totally in C. In which case, a good grounding in OOP, C++, design issues, algorithms, and data structures, are all likely to get taught to you on, for example, a BSc Computing/Computer Studies course.
Someone mentioned that you won''t have much creative input as a programmer in someone else''s company, and they''re probably right. One of the great things about university is that you get lots and lots of free time... that time can be translated into you getting -your- game made. You will also meet numerous like-minded individuals on your course who may be able to help with your game, if you asked them. They too, will have lots of free time. You don''t get many opportunities in life to do whatever you want, and also to make that many contacts.
Regarding the debt thing, if you took out govt. student loans here, the rates are very reasonable and you won''t have to start repaying until you earn a decent amount anyway. You will never get offered any loans at such good rates again!
Finally, as was already pointed out, jobs are not forever, especially in the technology industry, and a degree will help you find subsequent jobs, or find better paid jobs, or more fun jobs. For an investment of 3-4 years (during which you can also be making your own game!), you gain a substantial step up on the career ladder for the future.
*smirks* I''m almost glad that I was an absolute NOBODY at programming when I started Uni, so that I was never faced with this problem.
I think one thing to add is:
At university they''ll teach you a lot of things that might seem useless and unrelated at the time, but someday it will turn out that they can be applied in great and fascinating ways. I remember the compiler classes, and now everyone is putting scripting languages in their games...just a small example.
It never hurts to learn more, and that little bit of paper you get at the end is very valuable to a lot of companies.
Give me one more medicated peaceful moment.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~
ERROR: Your beta-version of Life1.0 has expired. Please upgrade to the full version. All important social functions will be disabled from now on.
I think one thing to add is:
At university they''ll teach you a lot of things that might seem useless and unrelated at the time, but someday it will turn out that they can be applied in great and fascinating ways. I remember the compiler classes, and now everyone is putting scripting languages in their games...just a small example.
It never hurts to learn more, and that little bit of paper you get at the end is very valuable to a lot of companies.
Give me one more medicated peaceful moment.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~
ERROR: Your beta-version of Life1.0 has expired. Please upgrade to the full version. All important social functions will be disabled from now on.
Author
Thanks again everybody, I''ve decided that I will go to Uni now (hopefully) I should be getting my place sorted this week.
I''ve decided that the 3 year investment is probably worth it, and besides, where else can you go and have so much fun, and so little worries. (I hope anyway)
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Freeride Designs
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I''ve decided that the 3 year investment is probably worth it, and besides, where else can you go and have so much fun, and so little worries. (I hope anyway)
----------------
Freeride Designs
----------------
Interesting how the UK univs. are so different from US. I learn something new everyday It''s good that you don''t have to study subjects outside computing, providing that you at least know algebra. You''ll have a HUGE advantage over your classmates who most of them are only starting to program. I truly wish you the best of luck.
Jerry
It''s good that you don''t have to study subjects outside computing, providing that you at least know algebra. You''ll have a HUGE advantage over your classmates who most of them are only starting to program. I truly wish you the best of luck. Jerry
The purpose of a University is not to learn a job/skill but basically to learn thinking. Learning C++, OOPS is very nice on the short term but on the longer term completely useless. Programming languages, design and architecture methods are constantly changing and i can assure you that they will change many times in a working life of 40 years.
Learn basic computer science but also do some economics and management classes. Spend even some time in completely other
subjects like history or chemistry, you never know in which part of the industry you will work. Nobody will work his entire life in the same industry, maybe the current gaming industry will completely vanish in the future (transcedent gaming?)!
Learning pratical programming: just read a book or do a course!
Learn basic computer science but also do some economics and management classes. Spend even some time in completely other
subjects like history or chemistry, you never know in which part of the industry you will work. Nobody will work his entire life in the same industry, maybe the current gaming industry will completely vanish in the future (transcedent gaming?)!
Learning pratical programming: just read a book or do a course!
A uni is also a great way to meet ppl who may be interested in helping out with your game. It might be easier to start a company with the friends and the degree. Also, having a degree is a major plus for when you are asking companies like Eidos and EA to give you money. 
Dont forget that college is a great experiance, and passing it up would mean life long remorse, if you watch all those movies that have fraternity parties and such.
My vote is going to a uni, and trying to start a company.
The experiance is worth the hundreds of thousands of dollars you''ll pay!
-I'm a little Teapot
"And don't quote me on that"
Dont forget that college is a great experiance, and passing it up would mean life long remorse, if you watch all those movies that have fraternity parties and such.
My vote is going to a uni, and trying to start a company.
The experiance is worth the hundreds of thousands of dollars you''ll pay!
-I'm a little Teapot
"And don't quote me on that"
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