I decided to bring this up so that we can all help expand our minds to the possibilities of the electronic games medium. For people who are blind to what is being discussed in these forums, this is about the removal of the genre casting for Developers. As developers we do not need to think in terms of genres when creating our games. Genres are what the marketing people stick your game into to categorise them as best as they can. Let us leave the genres to the marketers and salespeople and us developers can attributize our work to determine its use... I would like to see what attributes that would interest you if introduced into games. Examples of this include things such as Views/Perspective..., Story attributes (linear/tree/interactive... etc), Character attributes (team/individual...), NPC and Enemy attributes (stand alone/Self-motivated/personal-agenda) as well as any plot elements... What elements can you come up with that could categorise your game? -Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche           

Are we to be limiting ourselves to game mechanics or just any general term that could describe the game.

Some of the following might be attributes:
the use of magic
the kind of interaction allowed between player and NPC
the types of goals the player must achieve
the setting

I remember that the main complaint about ganeres is that they were not well-defined. What would be considered an attribute? Are attributes separate from say, plot? Is ''the player goes around killing dragons'' an attribute?

I am so glad that Landfish is finally getting the respect he deserves.

It''s a weird idea I''ve come up with, but have been thinking about recently. You know how single-player games are, right? With storylines that move you along and such. Multi-player games are usually nothing like that. Usually a static world that doesn''t change with the same big boss guy being defeated by 5,000,000 people world-wide. I think that a non-static multiplayer game would be kinda cool. Imagine a multi-player game where the plot actually advances. It does complicate the designing, of course. Single-player games, the plot starts when you start the game. Multi-player games start when the first person starts playing. Some guy who shells out $50 may come in when the game is close to ending. Not a good idea?

Well, there would be alternatives. Like maybe the story resets after it gets to its conclusion, and all characters are reverted to as if they just entered the game. Or, maybe you design the game so that you (the designers) can design the next storyline while the first one is in progress. Sorta like having an online-DM. The only bad thing about that is, it means that a designer can''t exactly start designing the next game, you are stuck on that particular game. And what if you decide that you are done and want to move on? Those Joe Blows that spent $50 only to find out that there is no more storylines are going to be sore.

I don''t know, that is something that I''m not going to solve in 10 minutes, but I still think a non-static multiplayer online game would be very interesting. (Note I didn''t say RPG anywhere!! This idea could apply to anything)

-Blackstream

"See you later, I'm going to go grab a few Bytes. I'm so thirsty, I could drink a whole data stream."

To answer you, Blackstream, without going into the myriad difficulties involved, random story-lines.

I am so glad that Landfish is finally getting the respect he deserves.

Blackstream - check out one of those "How to Host a Murder" party kits.

Game elements that I just generally think are cool but under-discussed are:

Games that test for the player''s personality/ethics and conform themselves to these. Essentially, any game that asks the player: what do you like? and tries to give it to them.

Puzzles that involve manipulating a simulation of a physical system (e.g. sliding/twisting puzzles, many of the puzzles in Jewels of the Oracle). More generally, what type(s) of puzzle do(es) the game have

A plot-driven main game with strategy sub-games. (Or other kinds of sub-games, but I like strategy.) These sub-games have to significantly affect the resources that you get to use in the main game.

Great all... This is not just limited to game mechanics. It includes any aspect of ANYTHING that you would want in a game.

We''re on the right track

Well there are some mechanics things:

Murder-Based
Stat Maxing
Experience System
Skills system
etc..

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche
          

If this includes everything, why have a formal/(not-so-formal) list of attributes? You could do more of a back-cover (like on books)

This game is an intense thriller filled with murder and suspense . . .

In other words, what prevents these ''attributes'' from becoming a paragraph or two that describes the game? Or is that the point? Or are you looking for short, consice terms that are quickly picked up on?

Character-focused
Strategic warfare
New York Times bestseller . . . maybe not
party-based combat


Think outside the dodecahedron

Some attributes to ponder and develop:

Society building in multiplayer: players build and develop societies and organizations together which service and threaten other players'' societies and organizations. Players define the structure, hierarchy, rules, and laws of their organizations.

Multi-agent (NPC) communication and cooperation: Requires knowledge and how to use knowledge.

Random goal generation with random side-plots and sub-plots added to remove the template feel of the goals.

An AI game-moderator which may override and prevent unlucky events (like character death) if this is going to do nothing for the player''s enjoyment of the game. In other words, there are certain types of games where immersion and experience are more important than strictly testing the player''s ability to advance.

Detailed health and medical modeling of the character without boring the player with the details. In other words, a player may die of bleeding to death or severe head trauma.

Some possible scenarios that I believe should see more exposure include: (note these need not be cast within any game framework)

Alternative realities / alternative worlds. (sci-fi, but with little emphasis on space or high-tech)

Wild West: horses, guns, trains, outlaws, wanted posters, etc.

Forensic medicine: crime scene investigation, criminal profiling, etc.

Medical thrillers: Probing sinister medical plots, exposing patient testing, etc.

Technical thrillers: Genetic engineering, viruses, DNA manipulation, etc.

Hacking: Either networks, or highrise buildings, information attainment, extraction, etc.

Intrigue: Espionage, spying, intelligence operations, etc.

Political: Power hierarchies, organizations, etc. (see the first paragraph of this post).

The reason we want a list is because we want ideas that haven''t been thought of or implemented. If we just think of them as possible attributes to be put into games, then we are more likely to see them implemented. I agree with you though that attributes needn''t be defined, I just wanted ideas to tell the truth ... good ideas people

-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft - Site:"The Philosophers' Stone of Programming Alchemy" - IOL
The future of RPGs - Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche