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Library

Game Design and Theory Game Design

Started by runemaster November 12, 2000 04:23 AM

31 comments, last by runemaster 23 years, 7 months ago

runemaster

122

Author

November 12, 2000 04:23 AM

I was thinking that in most RPGs there are no real libraries.In Ultima there was one, but there were hardly any books in it.Wouldn''t it be sort of nice if there was one or even more great libraries full of books on very many subjects ? I think it would add both to the atmosphere and to the gameplay.A mage could spend time reading books and maybe even- using some skill like write or scribe -copy them or parts of them to keep.And if the player heard some interesting story or just met a monster he didn''t know he could go to the library and look for some info on it...I''m ranting, I know

but I think the idea is nice.Of course I''m talking about a hard-core RPG like in the days of old, not some fancy anime linear action-adventure labelled RPG (

). Runemaster now working on Acronia : Secrets of Magic Add your site to my free-for-all links page ! """"" "''Nazrix is cool'' -- Nazrix" --Darkmage --Godfree"-Nazrix" -- runemaster --and now dwarfsoft" -- dwarfsoft --pouya" -- Nazrix" -- Nazrix "I feel that posts of this nature are a perversion of the internet."-johnnyfish

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Nazrix

307

November 12, 2000 04:28 AM

Daggerfall did...

I think Daggerfall or Thief are those two games where I can say they did something that people tend to suggest. I''m proud of those two companies...anyway...

The problem w/ Daggerfall is that many, not all of the things covered in books were only for atmosphere and did not exist. Like most of the books were written from the first person. It would be cool if you could look for the author (assuming he/she is still alive). Also, in Daggerfall, the books spoke of dragons and there were none. It kind of killed the effect.

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Hase

313

November 13, 2000 04:41 AM

Nice idea, but in most RPGs there is not REALLY a demand for libraries. I´d say that players are generally too lazy and too keen on action to spend their time looking through books..

but it can never hurt to have books around. Just as long as it´s easy enough to actually find the information you need. Maybe a kind of keyword search in the shape of the librarian. You ask for books on a certain subject ("dragonslayer"), an then he will waddle off and get you a pile of books (Hurc the orc barbarian, Ruff the dragonslayer, Dragonslaying for dummies I-IV,...)
Becaus i think that only the really hardcore players would actually spend time looking through a library to find what they seek. (It takes long enough in real life)

MadKeithV

992

November 13, 2000 04:59 AM

quote: Original post by Hase

Nice idea, but in most RPGs there is not REALLY a demand for libraries. I´d say that players are generally too lazy and too keen on action to spend their time looking through books..

If the player is itching for action, he/she should not be playing a ( true ) roleplaying game, but playing Quake instead. Or Diablo, for a fantasy hack-em-up.

RPGs are not action games. I think a library with information on a wide variety of subjects would work great - an in-game version of the reference manual, presented in a way that fits with the surroundings.
If spending time in the library could actually improve your skill in certain areas, that would be even more of a bonus.

People might not remember what you said, or what you did, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~

It's only funny 'till someone gets hurt.And then it's just hilarious.Unless it's you.

felonius

122

November 13, 2000 05:07 AM

I think this is really a matter of priority. There is a trend in this forum to want more options and features all the time. People tend to forget that resources are limited in game development and the developer would have to prioritize.

I would really like to see a full library in a game, but making one takes a lot of time and might not be the most important thing in a game. So the question is, do you want libraries so much that you are willing to sacrifice other parts of the game? Example areas could be:
* Length (playing time)
* Graphics/Sound quality
* Story and/or detail level in other places.

If you are not want to sacrifice anything, wanting more features is just ranting without purpose.

The good developer is the developer that knows which features are important and which aren''t.

Jacob Marner

Jacob Marner, M.Sc.Console Programmer, Deadline Games

Knarkles

271

November 13, 2000 05:17 AM

If you are going to have a library (not to mention several libraries) with several hundred books, how are you ever going to write all of them, while at the same time making a role-playing game? Even if they follow the trend in RPGs of having only a few pages, it's still at least worth a medium-sized novel. And they have to vary in styles and subjects to be believable. It's not reasonable, unless you have several dedicated writers on the team.

EDIT: Just to avoid looking like I don't like the idea: OF COURSE I would want a library in an RPG.

I just don't think it's possible.

-Jussi

Edited by - Selkrank on November 13, 2000 6:29:55 AM

Anonymous

November 13, 2000 05:26 AM

Maybe you could use old novels for which the copyright has expired. You could try to find electronic versions of obscure texts by 19th century authors like Bram Stoker and Mary Shelley. I don''t think too many people would recoqnize a text by Bram Stoker if it wasn''t Dracula.

Henry

kseh

3,998

November 13, 2000 05:44 AM

Reading books in a games has always been a double edged sword for me. On the one hand it can provide a great deal of background info and explain just why the heck you''re out there doing whatever you''re doing. But there''s nothing worse than flippin through each and every page to find the one little bit of info you''re looking for. Computer interfaces just don''t handle it very well.

122

November 13, 2000 06:05 AM

The approach to this problem that I''ve taken, within my ongoing MMO, is to give the players access to what at first is a near-enough empty library, save for a few ‘provided’ works, and the ability to write whatever they want into empty books which can then either be placed within the ‘public’ library, their guild library, hall library , or carried about upon their person.

In this way, those players who wish to boast of their exploits/write poems/ record in-world history/ minutes etc, have the ability to do so, with everything they write being added to the world (incl. Bad spellings

).

I’m not sure how this could be adapted to single-player worlds, since solo players rarely seem to feel the need to document their exploits.

The best thing I can think of in such a case, would be a system like Daggerfall’s, with enough reading material to fill a small novella, but preferabl linked to the world, such that reading the material provides hidden insights into the world.

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MadKeithV

992

November 13, 2000 06:26 AM

quote: Original post by felonius

I would really like to see a full library in a game, but making one takes a lot of time and might not be the most important thing in a game.

Depending on what you put in, it shouldn''t take much more than a day or two to implement. Normally, an RPG has a booklet shipped with it, with explanations about some items and monsters. The designers have to write small descriptions of their stuff anyway, in order to put it in the design document. Now, if this is done in a way that''s easy to add to in-game libraries ( consistent style and such ), then it doesn''t take any additional work time to have the info available.

However, that doesn''t go for works of fiction, which I also think have very little place inside an RPG, unless they are player-written.

People might not remember what you said, or what you did, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~

It's only funny 'till someone gets hurt.And then it's just hilarious.Unless it's you.

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