Re: Paul
Paul, do you play for the solo experience? If so I understand. Does the thought of running guilds, and building long term relationships with other players sound interesting? The social side of MMORPG:s requires 50,0000 hours. It takes alot more time to conversate and get to know people. The idea of having a lvl 50 mage perhaps is boring to you, if xp and leveling is all gaming is about. The perm death works well if you are not into social gaming, otherwise situations likes oops one of our guilding founding members just got perm killed guess we should disband.
🎉 Celebrating 25 Years of GameDev.net! 🎉
Not many can claim 25 years on the Internet! Join us in celebrating this milestone. Learn more about our history, and thank you for being a part of our community!
PvP and Perm Death....Good combo?
How about throwing the ball in the player''s court and asking
him or her much like how Diablo2 does it with a normal character
and a hardcore character?
him or her much like how Diablo2 does it with a normal character
and a hardcore character?
quote: Original post by Spyder
Re: Paul
Paul, do you play for the solo experience? If so I understand. Does the thought of running guilds, and building long term relationships with other players sound interesting? The social side of MMORPG:s requires 50,0000 hours. It takes alot more time to conversate and get to know people. The idea of having a lvl 50 mage perhaps is boring to you, if xp and leveling is all gaming is about. The perm death works well if you are not into social gaming, otherwise situations likes oops one of our guilding founding members just got perm killed guess we should disband.
But allowing the player to perm die would allow for more chances for people to rise to power in a guild/yes? Also a valuable individual in a group would have to be protected by his/her fellows which i think would bring a lot of fun into the game. If you''re valuable character got killed i don''t see how it''s going to destroy the social element. This is where smart game designing comes in. You''d have to allow everyone to have a secondary identity so even when you die people can still recognise you.
I love Game Design and it loves me back.
Our Goal is "Fun"!
RE: Paul
From personal experience an online guild is often more fragile than a rl club, but that''s not to say there are exceptions. Hierarchy in a online guild where a leader is killed and lower titles move up is interesting. But do you suggest this to be hardcoded or should the players themselves appoint a new leader? The online guilds that thrive the most consist of players that know it each other in rl, but this is not in any way the most interesting guilds/clans etc.
I like the idea of having ones identity being intact after death so that other players can recognize the dead, but how would this be done? Like stated earlier if you are allowed to keep your name is it really a perm death? In my opinion no.
From personal experience an online guild is often more fragile than a rl club, but that''s not to say there are exceptions. Hierarchy in a online guild where a leader is killed and lower titles move up is interesting. But do you suggest this to be hardcoded or should the players themselves appoint a new leader? The online guilds that thrive the most consist of players that know it each other in rl, but this is not in any way the most interesting guilds/clans etc.
I like the idea of having ones identity being intact after death so that other players can recognize the dead, but how would this be done? Like stated earlier if you are allowed to keep your name is it really a perm death? In my opinion no.
quote: By Spyder
I like the idea of having ones identity being intact after death so that other players can recognize the dead, but how would this be done? Like stated earlier if you are allowed to keep your name is it really a perm death? In my opinion no.
Becuase of the familiarity of the name? I understand. You could have a player template or alias. Example: I login at gamedev under the name of Dr Jeckle but when i go into a gamedev game I choose a name for my character which is Mr.Hyde. If a player goes to the (forum)game stats page then they see that Mr Hyde is being played by Dr Jeckle. The game stats will show you how many and what were the names of characters that died under my control and which character/s i am currently using. Hows that?
I love Game Design and it loves me back.
Our Goal is "Fun"!
I think you''re onto something here -
separate player and character in the game. Permanent character death should not diminish the player. For instance - if you had every character in your game mentioned like in a movie : "Captain FreshMeat, played by Sir Beanu Keaves", you could see who you''re dealing with. Have scores kept per player, so you can see if that crappy-looking 1st level character is being played by the best player in the game! You could have a high-rollover - character death occurs quite frequently, possibly due to natural causes as well. That way, you can have permanent character death, but the player doesn''t disappear.
Give me one more medicated peaceful moment.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~
ERROR: Your beta-version of Life1.0 has expired. Please upgrade to the full version. All important social functions will be disabled from now on.
separate player and character in the game. Permanent character death should not diminish the player. For instance - if you had every character in your game mentioned like in a movie : "Captain FreshMeat, played by Sir Beanu Keaves", you could see who you''re dealing with. Have scores kept per player, so you can see if that crappy-looking 1st level character is being played by the best player in the game! You could have a high-rollover - character death occurs quite frequently, possibly due to natural causes as well. That way, you can have permanent character death, but the player doesn''t disappear.
Give me one more medicated peaceful moment.
~ (V)^|) |<é!t|-| ~
ERROR: Your beta-version of Life1.0 has expired. Please upgrade to the full version. All important social functions will be disabled from now on.
We''re talking about worlds of adventure here. If you don''t want to die young, stay home and do your mundane little job. That''s what the real life is for. I want to be a hero, defeating evil and skirting death. Permanent death works for me only when there''s a higher force (GM) tweaking the dice to make my character a hero. I want a character I can relate with and actually become for a while. If my character can''t be a hero, then what good is he to me? In a MMORPG, there''s no GM to tweak the dice rolls, so I need some way of cheating death so that my character can go on to become a hero. I personally think that permanent death will never be more than an annoyance in an Internet-based MMORPG. That''s just the nature of the beast.
What about permanent life? I die and go to the afterlife. Normally this a place where I would gain my eternal reward along side the god/ideal I faithfully served in life, but now the gods are bound and the afterlife is some contorted and perverse reflection of the real world. Now the dead rise again.
I can walk the afterlife much the way I walked the real world in life. There are adventures there, and there are opportunities for me to earn my life back. Or I can return to the real world as a ghost or ghoul. My spirit lives on and has further adventure options. The game doesn''t end when I die, but neither is death cheapened by instant respawning. Now I have a new problem to solve and a new path to follow. If I stay dead, I can help fight the demons that have imprisoned the gods, etc.
I consider myself a true roleplayer, and I don''t appreciate someone telling me I''m not because I don''t see things his way. I firmly believe that permanent death won''t work in a MMORPG in general. Make it an option, a risk that the player must intentionally take.
Pax
What about permanent life? I die and go to the afterlife. Normally this a place where I would gain my eternal reward along side the god/ideal I faithfully served in life, but now the gods are bound and the afterlife is some contorted and perverse reflection of the real world. Now the dead rise again.
I can walk the afterlife much the way I walked the real world in life. There are adventures there, and there are opportunities for me to earn my life back. Or I can return to the real world as a ghost or ghoul. My spirit lives on and has further adventure options. The game doesn''t end when I die, but neither is death cheapened by instant respawning. Now I have a new problem to solve and a new path to follow. If I stay dead, I can help fight the demons that have imprisoned the gods, etc.
I consider myself a true roleplayer, and I don''t appreciate someone telling me I''m not because I don''t see things his way. I firmly believe that permanent death won''t work in a MMORPG in general. Make it an option, a risk that the player must intentionally take.
Pax
quote: Original post by pax
We''re talking about worlds of adventure here. If you don''t want to die young, stay home and do your mundane little job. That''s what the real life is for. I want to be a hero, defeating evil and skirting death. Permanent death works for me only when there''s a higher force (GM) tweaking the dice to make my character a hero. I want a character I can relate with and actually become for a while. If my character can''t be a hero, then what good is he to me? In a MMORPG, there''s no GM to tweak the dice rolls, so I need some way of cheating death so that my character can go on to become a hero. I personally think that permanent death will never be more than an annoyance in an Internet-based MMORPG. That''s just the nature of the beast.
Have you read my doc, specifically on death and afterlife? It has a lot of stuff on reincarnation, possession and karma... It is over in the section titled Death and Karma. Take a gander
quote:
What about permanent life? I die and go to the afterlife. Normally this a place where I would gain my eternal reward along side the god/ideal I faithfully served in life, but now the gods are bound and the afterlife is some contorted and perverse reflection of the real world. Now the dead rise again.
Maybe you can act as a kind of ghost that haunts your NPC party to finish your quest, or to find you a new body to inhabit... Interesting. Theoretically you could then possess the body of that dragon that you got them to slay
quote:
I can walk the afterlife much the way I walked the real world in life. There are adventures there, and there are opportunities for me to earn my life back. Or I can return to the real world as a ghost or ghoul. My spirit lives on and has further adventure options. The game doesn''t end when I die, but neither is death cheapened by instant respawning. Now I have a new problem to solve and a new path to follow. If I stay dead, I can help fight the demons that have imprisoned the gods, etc.
See above
quote:
I consider myself a true roleplayer, and I don''t appreciate someone telling me I''m not because I don''t see things his way. I firmly believe that permanent death won''t work in a MMORPG in general. Make it an option, a risk that the player must intentionally take.
Pax
I think that it adds a little more to the experience. It makes the player value life a lot more... It should not be something that you force upon a beginner, and you should not kill a player permanently if they were PKed. Therefore you should be able to have duels so that a fair fight will determine who is right and who is left
. Permanent death can work in MMORPG, but it is difficult to secure it, especially when lag comes into play. Nobody like lag to permanently remove their character from the world. I would see permanent death be something that gradually happens as the character builds. If they are really powerful then they get asked if they wish to live until their task is complete or to peacefully exit to the next world. This reminds me a little of Nevyn from Katherine Kerrs books (swore an oath to the gods that he would live until he completed the task of converting his love to the Dweomer [magic], but he didn''t realise that it would take him 600-800 years ).Maybe if you choose the first option, then your character would wither with time, so they would not be as effective as a ''sturdy young adventurer'' (gee... I am sounding like Elzix from Diablo II) but if they chose the second option, then they would be strong and full until the day they die. It is kind of a trade off....
What do people think?
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft
"The Philosophers' Stone of Programming Alchemy"
IOL (The list formerly known as NPCAI) - A GDNet production
Our Doc - The future of RPGs
Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche
Here is an idea. Maybe you should have some sort of karma system. For instance, if a lvl 50 player got his rocks off by killing lvl 2 or 3 players and suddenly met up with a pack of fire dragons that then proceeded to kill him, he would be reincarnated into something less desireable than he was, say a rat or a snake. If on the other hand, the same player was being attacked by other players and ended up dying, he might reincarnate into, say, a person with half the stats he had, plus a first time player''s stats. This would lead to other cool possibilities, like if you had really good karma, you might have the choice upon death of coming back in a better form like a dragon or a demigod.
This topic is closed to new replies.
Advertisement
Popular Topics
Advertisement
